MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Questions and answers about 3Dconnexion devices on macOS.

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RVeldhuyzen
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by RVeldhuyzen » Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:45 am

RVeldhuyzen wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:28 am
So, with the beta, did something change in the way movements are processed to Maya (running 2020.1 and I also verified with 2019.3)?
The camera rolls a lot now. I used to be able to rotate around my scene while the camera stayed parallel to the ground plane. I could roll but I had to work hard to make that happen (which is what I prefer). But now the slightest movement rolls the camera too.

It feels like instead of treating the scene ground plane as the base it treats an imaginary horizontal line on the screen as the ground plane over which it turns.

It's difficult to explain but imagine the camera was on a tripod that sat on the ground plane of the scene (green in the image below), the Spacenavigator made the tripod move in all directions and the camera pan and tilt.

Now, it seems like the gorund plane of the scene is ignored and instead it treats the red line as the plane the tripod is on, so if the camera is positioned as in the screenshot, spinning the navigator doesn't just spin the camera, it rolls it too. Does that make sense? :P

It would be impossible to end up with the scene upside down unless I manually flipped the camera. Now it takes a few moves with the navigator to get me to Australia.

Image
Okay, so after trying to actually work with it I found that this bug is still here. The viewport still glitches a bunch, sometimes just seems to freeze until I click, after which it jumps to where it is supposed to go. Annoying, but not the end of the world.

The weird ground plane thing is also annoying as all heck, it takes a LOT of effort to keep my camera even close to level. Also very annoying, but again, not the end of the world.

A dealbreaker is the fact that Maya 2020.1 crashes every few minutes when using the Spacenavigator :/ Just crashes to desktop.

So it is completely unusable right now.
Any chance the new beta you were planning for later this week fixes it so I can at least use it and get back to work?
It's time to roll the dice...

RVeldhuyzen
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by RVeldhuyzen » Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:47 am

https://forum.3dconnexion.com/viewtopic ... 23&t=38171
This is the bug I wanted to mention above. The glitching viewport.
It's time to roll the dice...

marcarch
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by marcarch » Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:16 am

ngomes wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:35 am
We were only too aware of macOS 11. This hasn't been an easy ride for us and it is not over yet.
I see analogies between 3Dconnexion CM-CMW and Apple original Magic Mouse: both clicks aren’t supported on iPadOS 14.
But, while CM-CMW don’t work on macOS Catalina and Big Sur neither, Apple original Magic Mouse does.
Is this an old hardware spec limit “imposed” by Apple? What causes the issue?

ngomes
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by ngomes » Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:21 am

marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:16 am
Is this an old hardware spec limit “imposed” by Apple? What causes the issue?
I think there's nothing forced by Apple. We believe there's a bug in the system (since OS X 10.10) that causes the hardware descriptors to be incorrectly parsed. As I mentioned before, the original CadMouse worked fine in OS X 10.9.

3Dconnexion worked around the problem introduced in OS X 10.10 with a kernel extension (kext), a technology no longer available in macOS 11. 3Dconnexion was unable to use "System Extensions" ("dext") as a replacement.

marcarch
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by marcarch » Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:44 am

ngomes wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:21 am
I think there's nothing forced by Apple. We believe there's a bug in the system (since OS X 10.10) that causes the hardware descriptors to be incorrectly parsed. As I mentioned before, the original CadMouse worked fine in OS X 10.9.
Could you please elaborate? If a bug is, it must be solved.
I'm gonna get in touch with Apple about this, like you already did, but maybe 2 voices are louder than one?

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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by ngomes » Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:04 am

marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:44 am
Could you please elaborate?
When enumerating a USB device with multiple collections, the system (as of OS X 10.10 and newer) will override the buttons in the first "mouse" collection with the second (the "multi-axis controller" collection). Since the mouse buttons are in the first collection, they become unavailable. When the user presses a CadMouse button, the data is still sent to the OS but only to be ignored.

marcarch
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by marcarch » Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:53 am

ngomes wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:04 am
marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:44 am
Could you please elaborate?
When enumerating a USB device with multiple collections, the system (as of OS X 10.10 and newer) will override the buttons in the first "mouse" collection with the second (the "multi-axis controller" collection). Since the mouse buttons are in the first collection, they become unavailable. When the user presses a CadMouse button, the data is still sent to the OS but only to be ignored.
Thank you so much for sharing the infos.
The case at Apple is scaling up, I'll have a remote session with a technician tomorrow.

Meanwhile I'm curious to understand: how did 3Dconnexion bypass this likely bug with the new CadMouse Pro?

ngomes
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by ngomes » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:03 am

marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:53 am
Meanwhile I'm curious to understand: how did 3Dconnexion bypass this likely bug with the new CadMouse Pro?
We have multiple interfaces in the CadMouse Pro Wireless and newer device types like the CadMouse Pro. The newer types are "USB composite devices".

KlaudioPer
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by KlaudioPer » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:21 am

ngomes wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:22 am
KlaudioPer wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:56 am
- The Display (reason why I spent almost $500 for this product) doesn't show the Icons, but text only.. This is an old problem, never addressed !!
This is a feature not yet available on the Mac. We will get there but the focus has in been in ensuring the core functionality.

:arrow: Thanks for this, but I believe that such as fundamental info should be disclose at the main page of the 3Dconnexion website, right next to the "BUY" button! Maybe I'm the only one seeing this here, but the big difference between the SME $399+tax and SMP $299+tax is the Display which if for I user like me (Mac + F360) doesn't work properly.... I really don't see why should I invest my money for the most expensive product.

- The Lock rotation button is NOT working anymore. This is one of the most used function, especially in sketch mode (F360)....
This appears to be a bug in the SpaceMouse Enterprise (SME) default button assignments or in the "lock rotation" driver function. This is expected to be fixed before we exit the beta of the new driver (v. 10.7.0).

:arrow: Thanks, I really looking forward to it.

- Buttons 1 to 12 doesn't correspond to the mapping assigned. In F360 they only activate the "Appearance" nothing else!

As mentioned above, I think there's something not quite right with the default button assignments in some scenarios. We'll be fixing this.

:arrow: Thanks, I really looking forward to it.
- Custom View buttons are not working (this is an old issue)
Can you give us some additional details? We expect the Custom Views to work on applications such as SketchUp, Onshape, Maya and the 3Dconnexion Viewer. Not all applications have support for this feature.

:arrow: I just tried the SME on SketchUp Pro 2018, see below what I got:

:arrow: Buttons from 1-12 are the only thing working properly!
:arrow: Wheel for movement completely disabled
:arrow: Every other button (except the 12 already mentioned) are NOT working at all
:arrow: I also noticed that no matter which application is running on my Mac (even none), when the SME is connected to the USB port, the Mac doesn't go in sleep mode. I also tried manually, but seems that SME keeps it awake. When I disconnect the SME the Mac goes (regularly) in sleep mode.

Please find my answer :arrow:

ngomes
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by ngomes » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:28 am

KlaudioPer wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:21 am
:arrow: I just tried the SME on SketchUp Pro 2018, see below what I got:

:arrow: Buttons from 1-12 are the only thing working properly!
:arrow: Wheel for movement completely disabled
:arrow: Every other button (except the 12 already mentioned) are NOT working at all
SketchUp support in beta 5 is broken (no "wheel movement"). The issue is fixed in beta 6 and needs only to be validated as part of the beta programme to be closed.
:arrow: I also noticed that no matter which application is running on my Mac (even none), when the SME is connected to the USB port, the Mac doesn't go in sleep mode. I also tried manually, but seems that SME keeps it awake. When I disconnect the SME the Mac goes (regularly) in sleep mode.
This seems like your SME is "drifting" (always sending data even when the user is not touching the device). This can happen if the device was placed in storage with something on top of it as the strings will take some time to "relax" to the usual position.

If this does not improve, get in touch with our Technical Support team and they will be able to confirm if there's something wrong.

Having said that, I cannot rule out a change in macOS 11 that may be preventing the system from going to sleep but I would find this unlikely.

ngomes
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by ngomes » Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:55 am

ngomes wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:04 am
marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:44 am
Could you please elaborate?
When enumerating a USB device with multiple collections, the system (as of OS X 10.10 and newer) will override the buttons in the first "mouse" collection with the second (the "multi-axis controller" collection). Since the mouse buttons are in the first collection, they become unavailable. When the user presses a CadMouse button, the data is still sent to the OS but only to be ignored.
This issue was reported to Apple using the "bug reporter" and was logged with number 20054976. Apple's "Developer Technical Support" team logged it with number 619749469. The problem was introduced in OS X 10.10 "Yosemite".

marcarch
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by marcarch » Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:11 am

ngomes wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:55 am
ngomes wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:04 am
marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:44 am
Could you please elaborate?
When enumerating a USB device with multiple collections, the system (as of OS X 10.10 and newer) will override the buttons in the first "mouse" collection with the second (the "multi-axis controller" collection). Since the mouse buttons are in the first collection, they become unavailable. When the user presses a CadMouse button, the data is still sent to the OS but only to be ignored.
This issue was reported to Apple using the "bug reporter" and was logged with number 20054976. Apple's "Developer Technical Support" team logged it with number 619749469. The problem was introduced in OS X 10.10 "Yosemite".
Thank you so much for these additional infos.
Apple never replied to the case via Bug Reporter, right?

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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by ngomes » Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:28 am

marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:11 am
Apple never replied to the case via Bug Reporter, right?
Apple did reply and engaged with 3Dconnexion.

marcarch
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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by marcarch » Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:37 am

ngomes wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:28 am
marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:11 am
Apple never replied to the case via Bug Reporter, right?
Apple did reply and engaged with 3Dconnexion.
Oh, ok. So what was or is the situation with them? You're saying it's a bug, while Apple told you it's not?

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Re: MacOS 11.00 (Big Sur)

Post by ngomes » Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:49 am

marcarch wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:37 am
Oh, ok. So what was or is the situation with them? You're saying it's a bug, while Apple told you it's not?
As you might expect, we cannot share the details of discussions with our partners, Apple or anyone else, without their prior approval.

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